NEOBAGGINS RESPONDS to "99 REASON WHY TDKR SUCKED"

NEOBAGGINS RESPONDS to "99 REASON WHY TDKR SUCKED"

I just did the first 20. Not trying to type a novel for one or two people to read.

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By NeoBaggins - 8/5/2012
My style can be a little abrasive, but this is all in good fun. I have no anomisty towards the guy who made this list and believe strongly in freedom of opinion and expression. Even Trolls. How else could we disquinsh ourselves from them?

Congrats to leconnaisseur!

You're response article made it to 6 pages, much further than I would have expected a non-bashing Batman article to go. Good job.




1.Pacing of the story was horrible. It felt like watching a 3-hour long trailer where dialogue is delivered at a snap pace and given no time to sink in.

No time to sink in as in, the content eluded you? That’s strange considering your mutant-like memory of obscure details and stopping to formulate complex, yet retarded conclusions during and after the movie. So, it would be contradictory for you to see the dialogue at a “snap pace” yet accessible enough to acknowledge “99 problems”.

Maybe if you saw the film like 10 times, I could buy this. But seeing how much you hated the film, repeat viewings would imply grossly illogical behavior. And you’re a smart guy, so I’ll assume you’ve seen the film once.

2. Despite this fast pace to get all this story crammed in there are at least a good 5-10 minutes of time wasted showing Batman on top of a building overlooking the city.

I’ve seen the film twice and I only remember seeing Batman on high overlooking the city ONCE. Claiming that there is 5 to 10 minutes of this element when there clearly isn’t, demonstrates an inability to process simple content and a gaping hole in credibility.

But having mutant powers, you may be seeing the film in different realities, thus giving us an account from an alternative version of the film.

3. Even the Batman/Selina kiss at the end felt "loveless" and thrown in "just because"

I never thought Luke and Liea were supposed to be in love during that good luck kiss in STAR WARS. Hell, I didn’t know that people were ONLY supposed to kiss in movies if there weren't clearly in love which is hardly ever the case. There are probably 1000 movies or more where someone spontaneously kisses someone. It’s pretty standard stuff. Loveless? Lol I need to see your Love Doctor license. Not buying this one. It’s filler.

4. I believe studio script writers who had to review the film were too scared to tell Christopher Nolan he has to "show" rather than "tell". The film contained far too much junk that just simply tells us what is going on rather than let us actually experience. We are told the villains motivations are to build up hope of the people then bring it crashing down yet we never see this occur. We are told how fast, brutal, and ferocious Bane is yet the fight scene choreography was rather slow and dull. One last example comes in the clues that Bruce is still alive then we see Bruce in the cafe, the shot of him in the cafe went far too long and should have only had Alfred get a passing glimpse of Bruce and the result would have been more ambiguous and more Christopher Nolan.

You want to see rather than be told in a film were your already bitching about the running time? Okay.

I think the fighting in this film was better than what was shown in Batman Begins and The Dark Knight, but I do not agree with some of the choreography such as Batman’s wild swings as if Hardy and Bale were left to come up with the fight on their own. Their first fight is epic, but choreography could have definitely been stepped up.

Fan fiction cannot be passed off as a legitimate problem. You basically explained how YOU would have written the café scene- even more ridiculous that you label your version as “more Christopher Nolan”.

5. Both villain deaths were pathetic and anti-climactic. Bane was blown to smithereens by Catwoman and Miranda/Talia is killed in a car crash. Batman doesn't actually/directly defeat either villain in the film. Hell, technically Batman just sets the jet to auto-pilot and The Bat vehicle takes care of the bomb. Maybe Bruce should have retired earlier and let Robin do all the work because he was a bum throughout most of the film. By far the most un-heroic hero of all superhero movies of late.

I agree that Bane’s death was anti-climactic. The character deserved more. But he WAS defeated by Batman, right before he took a knife between the ribs.

And yes, the Bat vehicle takes care of the bomb, because unlike Godzilla, he couldn’t swallow it and have it explode safely in his belly. And I believe it may have been too heavy to run around with like Adam West did.

If his method of disposing of the bomb is “un-heroic”, I would like to hear the heroic version. This can NEVER get too funny.

6. The explanation for the villains motivations is to build up the hope of the people and then crush it. They take over the city and make the place hell for months. By this time people would have lost all hope with the way things were in the city. This bomb should have been detonated within a week of activation. At around this time people would begin to lose any hope.

Then maybe you should become a super villain, or a screenwriter. This insert is silly.

7. The count-down for the bomb was 5 months. The exact time Batman needed to recover and get back to Gotham. This plot is from a "visionary" director.

I don’t know if it took Bruce 5 months to recover, I’m not a mutant. But I do know that he was healthy at some point and trying to escape. But even if the timing is indeed convenient, it only proves that Nolan, like many other film makers, inserts standard movie elements. Because it’s Nolan, you’re holding him to a higher standard which is ironic when trying to discredit him. You’re inadvertently complimenting him.

In the nick of time is movie tradition.

8. A device that can completely erase someone's identity is a ridiculous concept like unobtanium from Avatar. No way the device works considering the size of the file that Blake shows to Selina at the airport. Can't erase a paper file too.

Eh, I don’t really care to defend this type of miniscule plot device. But with a little imagination, you can come to the conclusion that maybe the data isn’t meant to clean up Selina Kyles files. It may be an entirely different identity to be inserted into the system. Kyles records and PAPER records can remain as they are and she would no longer exist as Selina. I accept it and move on without pouring over it. Whatever.

9. The dialog in the script is overly dramatic and filled with far too much exposition. Nobody talks like that in real life and for a movie grounded in realism the amount of exposition took me out of the narrative in several scenes.

Yes, yes. There should have been facebook references and usage of the word fuck. I don’t know. But yeah, there was some exposition in the film and definitely dramatic. Being that I’ve seen the previous two films, and Nolan’s films in general, this doesn’t surprise me or put me off the film. And again, this is not a “problem” but a personal interpretation of the material. You say it took YOU out of the narrative in several scenes. Weird; with them mutant powers you seemed to be one with the narrative, holding on to it like a Mc Hammer and his last paycheck.

10. For a movie grounded in realism (remember all the bruises from the first film) we see Batman shrug off an awful lot of punishment in this film. First the no cartilage in the knee, the ass beating/broken back from Bane, a stab to the gut from Talia. Batman shrugs all of this off and doesn't lose a single step. As a matter of fact, the more punishment he receives it appears the stronger he gets through the film.

Can you describe BATMAN for us, please?

“ Batman shrugs all of this off and doesn't lose a single step. As a matter of fact, the more punishment he receives it appears the stronger he gets through the film”.

Thanks.


11. Too much repetition in the script. Did we really need to hear JGL called a hot-head so many times? Did we really need to see the wheels on the Bat Pod flip 15 times? Did we really need to be constantly reminded that Bane was a member of the League of Shadows about 80 times by every character in the film practically?

Did we need to hear Blake being referred to as a hot-head “so many times”? Well, let’s see; I remember Foley calling him a hot-head during the bar/sewer scene, then again when Gordan says something to the effect that hot-heads are needed. I missed all the other times it was said and it must have been said a lot as you’ve described, otherwise, what you’ve stated would be… dumb?

When you say we were reminded of Bane’s League affiliation “80” times, I’m good enough to acknowledge that you’re exaggerating, but then you say “practically”, “by every character in the film”. Now we have to go back to the fact that your credibility as one who can successfully watch a movie is in question; to put it nicely.

12. The movie should have been titled Bruce Wayne Rises because Batman only has a very few scenes in the actual movie. As a matter of fact, a few of the minor characters probably share just as much screen time as the caped crusader.

None of the Nolan Batman films have a heavy amount of Batman until the final act where he remains suited and booted til the end. I think this is the first film where we see Bruce Wayne lastly instead of a suited Batman, which is part of the story being that he’s retired. But not enough Batman is definitely a fair gripe.

13. Several scenes involving the dark knight and the thick black makeup he wears around his eyes are noticeable. Particularly one scene where he is in the bat suit with the helmet off and no makeup is present or when he is captured by Bane who besides stripping him of his equipment felt the need to wash his face for him as well. We see this makeup present in almost every close-up face shot of Batman.

This is stupid. Next….

14. The change in shooting location from Chicago to Pittsburgh/New York made a very large difference in the feel of Gotham. In Batman Begins and TDK Gotham felt very dark and crime ridden as well as smaller. The scene change to New York/Pitt made it almost seem that Gotham was an entirely different city from the previous two films.

I think Gotham looks different from Batman Begins to The Dark Knight more so than The Dark Knight to The Dark Knight Rises. Overall, it’s consistent in its structures and landscape. I think it’s the atmosphere more so than the physical look of Gotham that changes. Still; nothing that could be logically applied to the quality of the film in a negative way, for me. But it sounds extremely painful…. For you.

These filler gripes are boring and make up the bulk of this absurd collection of troll problems. Let’s do a few more.

15. The reveal of Bane/Talia underscores Bane's entire character reducing him almost to henchman status and Talia gives us absolutely nothing to fear or show us that she is an evil bad guy since she dies five minutes later.

I almost mirror this sentiment in my review, but I really don’t touch basis on Talia’s imposition as a villain. But it is indeed a short run once she’s revealed. The movie was made to be that way so we can’t really label it as an actual problem. The plot line is deliberate and exactly the way the film maker wanted it. We either like it or we don't.

6. Despite the prison being constantly told how much of a hell hole it was when Batman was trapped in it the prison seemed fairly relaxed. You didn't see anyone trying to make a crippled Bruce Wayne their bitch, they had a prisoner with some medical training helping to take care of Bruce, they even had TV in the prison. Christopher Nolan should have consulted with the makers of Prison Break if he wanted to make a prison a hell hole because they did a better job of that in the season 3 Panama Prison.

You just expressed disappointment that no one tried to rape Bruce Wayne in prison. “Problem” dismissed for absurdity and creepiness.

Yes, they had a TV. But while you’re trying to give people the impression that he was watching a Star Trek marathon, we’ll save you a little dignity and remind everyone that the TV was there for Bruce to witness news coverage of Bane’s activities.

Shame on you.

17. The CIA allows three unidentified and hooded people who were captured onto their plane that is transporting a scientist at the beginning of the film because they supposedly have knowledge of the masked man named Bane and his group. They allow this without checking who these hooded people are. It was no surprise to anyone to find out one of these people was, in fact, Bane himself.

Eh. The agent was obviously ambitious and shady. Maybe getting them onboard first seemed more appropriate for shady activity. This is simply a theatrical element. The film needed the unmasking ON the plane. Surely you aren’t a fan of EXPOSITION, so I’m sure you wouldn’t want it spelled out for you as to why they weren’t unmasked on the spot.

18. A CIA plane transporting an important scientist they have captured seemingly has no radar support to realize another plan is hovering directly above them.

Let’s say it did. Now what?

19. Without doing any hard math on it. There is no way that the plane hijacking in the beginning was even remotely possible/believable. Everything from the plane that continues to fly needed some tremendous power/stability to stay in the air despite pulling another plane to the strength of the cables and joints holding the cables in being strong enough to the way the plane drags through the air (perpendicular to the ground) all defied logic and physics.

I never pondered the real life possibilities of this event. Chalked it up to movie shit. Looked great. If you can break down some statistics that would be interesting to see what degree this is possible. Other than that, no one cares.

20. Bane seems to have A LOT of suicidal followers throughout the film. It can be explained away as them being League of Shadows members. The only problem with this is The League of Shadows took a huge hit to their ranks in the first film. Even assuming that after Raz's death Talia took over and rebuilt their army was far too large and filled with far too many suicidal members.

I didn’t know that the League took a huge loss in ranks in Batman Begins. They were all living in that one hutt? I was under the impression that the league was vast and spans further than the house of ninjas. It would have to be to uphold the history explained by Ras’ Al Ghul.

You say the League army is filled with far too many suicidal members. I don’t remember anyone committing suicide unless that one dude, who I think stayed in the falling plane, is your definition of far too many members. Are we even thinking before we type this stuff out, or are we just typing it out knowing we have a built-in audience ready to applaud it without question. I think the latter.

Can I get a suicide count? Anybody.
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33 Comments
marvel72 - 8/5/2012, 7:48 AM
is this the shape of things to come.
redsoxdude - 8/5/2012, 9:20 AM
I just dont even know how to feel anymore.
Tainted87 - 8/5/2012, 9:28 AM
This is BULLSHIT. Is this really how this site is going to turn out? I can't believe the other one made MAIN, or even the original.

What about the well-written articles that make the readers THINK out of the ordinary? This is very discouraging.
NeoBaggins - 8/5/2012, 9:49 AM
@Tainted87 Hey, hey, heeey. I didn't make this to discourage quality content and/or to help bring the site down. This was the only thing going on and seemed like harmless fun. There's less than a hand full of members here and this isn't going main. I make reviews and stuff just to get it out of my system. It will be forgotten before I finish typing this.
CPBuff22 - 8/5/2012, 10:15 AM
And then August 2013 you will see a post that is a response to the response to the response to the response to the response to the response to the response to the response to the response to the response to the response to the response to the response to 99 Reasons why TDKR sucked.
NeoBaggins - 8/5/2012, 10:41 AM
"I don't want to think this but we have a nolanite in the room"

HHhmmm the old "Nolanite" schtick. Maybe I'll make an article listing the things I DON'T like about Nolan's films. Then they can't call me that.

batfan175 - 8/5/2012, 10:52 AM
I never noticed all these "flaws" even though i knew about them beforehand; the movie simply made me forget about those and that just shows what a good movie it is. if you go into it wanting to find flaws with it you're gonna find them. It's all a matter of taste anyway. However, if I male the effort to go into Marvel films unbiased surely others can do the same for Chris Nolan's batman films.
NeoBaggins - 8/5/2012, 11:00 AM
^^No they can't.
CPBuff22 - 8/5/2012, 12:04 PM
@batfan175 I honestly went in the first time to TDKR with pretty low expectations and they were not met. I seen it a second time as some people were telling me that all the problems I has would be cleared up with a second viewing, I came out having noticed more story arch issues than I did the first time.

I honestly gave it two chances both with low expectations and it disappointed both times.
superbatspiderman - 8/5/2012, 12:12 PM
@CPBuff22 - What were your expectations? The movie met my expectations and even surprised me at times. I was especially surprised when Bane actually broke Batman.
marvel72 - 8/5/2012, 1:01 PM
@ SUPERBATSPIDERMAN

i wasn't surprised there was photo or video showing tom hardy practising the back break.
StormLoganSummers - 8/5/2012, 1:05 PM
And the retardedness continues.
Knightrider - 8/5/2012, 5:45 PM
I do believe it is now time let this whole thing to rest. Whoever wrote the first article will never change their mind despite even some of his issues contradicting themselves and the rest being explained.

Some people, and I won't name, names as we know who they are, go in to these films if they be Marvel or DC and will hate them, they will just look for every little issue despite how small or petty, or not even true and will ignore all the good stuff.

It is sad, as I can't imagine what it must be like to be so stubborn, that if I liked DC over Marvel I would never allow myself to like a Marvel film, or would buy a movie ticket just so I can pick a movie apart.

So I say time to give it a rest, people will genuinely not like this film and that is fine.

Lets not turn the editorial section into "99 reasons [INSERT MOVIE HERE] sucked.
MrReese - 8/5/2012, 7:15 PM
@Marvel72 Is this the pic in question?



If so,I remember a lot of ppl saying Nolan would never "Break the Bat".When this specific pic came on here every1 said the dude was prolly a fan of the comics & asked Hardy if he would do it.Still No1 believed for a second Nolan would do this.I remember ppl saying he'll prolly break his leg or arm or something along those lines.I personally WAS shocked when it happened,cuz like many I thought Nolan would never do it.Or better yet how would that work out? Guess 4-5 months did the trick ey? XD
Supes17 - 8/5/2012, 10:46 PM
I got to see this:


I left the theater satisfied

>=D
Fastestmanalive - 8/6/2012, 7:44 AM
@Neobaggins
HAHAHA!!! Nice one.
HeadPool420 - 8/6/2012, 9:41 AM
This shits getting old.
Coldblood6 - 8/6/2012, 9:42 AM
Stop being a nolan-worshipping twit and start obsessing about something relevant.
marvel72 - 8/6/2012, 9:45 AM
@ mrreese

yup that's the one.
NeoBaggins - 8/6/2012, 10:45 AM
@Coldblood6 Give me something "relevant". I'm all ears.
Coldblood6 - 8/6/2012, 11:12 AM
The environment.
NeoBaggins - 8/6/2012, 11:41 AM
@Coldblood6 Sounds interesting. But since this is a comicbook movie site, ima talk about Batman.

Fail #2. Going for the hat trick?

Stumblin - 8/6/2012, 12:02 PM
Nice editorial NeoBaggins, I like that a lot of stuff that people complained about were even in the first two movies...but you never heard them bitch then.

My issues with this movie were small, but enough to make me not really enjoy it. It was an OK, but not my favorite, it's on the bottom of the trilogy with the Dark Knight at the top.
StrangerX - 8/6/2012, 1:12 PM
There were some cheesy parts, but that happens, and when it comes to big summer blockbusters this def surprised rather than disappoint. My main problem was although I like how Blake's character was fleshed out. Nolan should have just made him either Dick Grayson or Terry Mcguinness, Creating a new character was pointless.
NeoBaggins - 8/6/2012, 1:42 PM
@Stumblin Ah, you must see it like the Star Wars trilogy effect. The groundbreaking first film, the fan favorite second film, then the good but flawed third film.
Stumblin - 8/6/2012, 2:11 PM
For the most part yeah. I had really high hopes for this movie but didn't quite deliver. Better luck to the new director that takes on Batman, it'll be a tough act to follow.
NeoBaggins - 8/6/2012, 3:39 PM
I think the critical part for the reboot will be the casting. Making an awesome Batman film should be easy if they're smart about the approach.
PopcornMode - 8/6/2012, 10:46 PM
Good read, just like the '99 reasons'. When can we see the rest? I really enjoyed the movie, and it is great to read the views of both camps.
UrbanKnight - 8/7/2012, 2:26 PM
@MrReese Nolan likes to be unpredictable which makes his movies awesome. Flaws and all.
aztecRaingod - 8/7/2012, 6:48 PM
The only real problems I had with the film...

Batman getting with catwoman after she nearly has him killed, and imprisoned for nearly half a year. Just not very cool at all. I dont care how she changed as a person, or why she did it. Shes [frick]in dispicable.

Batmans "Rocky" training in the prison. Cliche and a little embarassing. (Only Bruce and a prepubescent girl have ever made that jump? Not saying alot for those prisoners.)

I know the beginning of the movie is setting the plot up, but good god, it was boring.

The CIA agents arent very smart, much like the Gotham police. ( Shooting someone in the head just to toss them out of a plane)


How in the [frick] does Gordon not know who Wayne is by the end of the movie??

The ending seemed rushed and slapped together... The finality of Bruce seemingly dying in the explosion was such, that it almost seemed like Nolan had second thoughts about such a dreary end, and decided to go with the alternate DVD ending instead..


Thalia Al Ghul is a villain for like 15 minutes, seemed pointless.

Sure, the clean energy machine had its place as a plot device, but when did Bruce Wayne become a a tree loving hippie...??

PopcornMode - 8/7/2012, 7:29 PM
@aztec "The CIA agents arent very smart, much like the Gotham police. ( Shooting someone in the head just to toss them out of a plane)"

They are obviously not very smart as they let 3 dudes to their plane without checking their faces first for security. But i guess their "not being smart" is the reason why the movie plot went on. They could have made it better, but the plane heist looked cool anyway, IMO.
RexLaboro - 8/7/2012, 11:48 PM
number 10 is epic haha
JHowlett - 8/9/2012, 3:00 AM
Oh jeez it was a good movie certainly was far from sucking if anyone can come up with 99 things wrong with that movie their being pompous and fastidious. Good responses Neo

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