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Thomas Jane Talks About The Punisher Movies

In an exclusive interview with MTV, Jane talks about his own experience playing Frank castle in the 2004 Punisher as well as his feelings on the follow up/reboot, Punisher: Warzone..
When Thomas Jane was approached to star in Lexi Alexander's Punisher movie, he declined citing "creative differences". In this interview with MTV he tells us why, among plenty of other things...

"My interest has always been based more in reality than in superhero fiction, and with the original 'Punisher' I very much pushed them to try to make a movie that was more like 'Death Wish' or 'Taxi Driver' than 'Spider-Man,'" Jane told MTV News. "The strengths of 'The Punisher' that I did lie in the reality that we were able to bring to the character, and the weaknesses of 'The Punisher' I did were all based on people trying to make this a 'comic book movie'—with funny characters and goofball s--t that has no place in a 'Punisher' film."

"'Punisher 2' went more in the direction of goofball comic-book world than in reality," he said. "The portraits of Punisher that Tim Bradstreet did, that’s the movie I want to see. [Those portraits] have a reality, grit and truth to them, and I think every 'Punisher' fan out there agrees with me. That’s what I was pushing for and that’s why I dropped out of 'Punisher 2'—because I’m not going to make a 'comic book movie.' It’s just doing a disservice to Frank Castle."

"Frank Castle has not got his due in the film world," said Jane. "I feel like it's been left unfinished."

"['The Dark Knight'] made $500 billion at the box office, so I felt vindicated—because everybody in the business who was familiar with what I was trying to do with 'Punisher 2' recognized that as the tone I was going for in 'Punisher 2,'" explained Jane. "Now that somebody actually accomplished that and put it on film and it received that response from the audience—[that] validates the idea that a Frank Castle movie needs to be a gritty, reality-based film."

"Everyone gets it backwards," he said. "The 'Punisher' comic is striving for a sense of reality. They’re not striving for a sense of 'comic book.' So in the film, you can actually take the reality element further—not the comic book element. You don’t want to strengthen the idea that it’s a comic book in film, because film gives you the chance to actually bring it one step closer to reality—and that's the direction that 'Punisher' wants to go in."

Well. I have to say I'm not too sure what the heck Jane is on about here! I mean I though Punisher: Warzone was a steaming pile of shit and I much preferred Jane's effort, but wasn't his movie the one with the silly comic relief characters? Warzone at least attempted gritty..well, it had peoples heads exploding, and called it gritty.

What do you think? Should The Punisher distance himself from the comic book universe? I mean, he does interact with the super heros, even if he isn't one of them. I think it might be better to embrace his comic roots, while still being as gritty as possible. How cool would it be to see castle turn up in another Marvel movie?

Thanks to MTV for the quotes.
17 Yes
1 No
RorMachine
10/7/2009
mtvsplashpage.com

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286 Comments

He is the PUNISHER!!!
LEEE777 - 10/7/2009, 11:59 AM
I liked him as The Punisher.

Have not seen War Zone...
bropous - 10/7/2009, 12:01 PM
i heard somewhere that he died it was late though so maybe i dreamed that part
bleedthefreak16 - 10/7/2009, 12:02 PM
WARZONE was the second worst MARVEL movie, you know the first! ; D

They soooo [frick]ed it up it wasnt funny!!!

JANE should do a HBO live series,,, I think WARZONE has killed anymore PUNISHER movies!


LEEE777 - 10/7/2009, 12:03 PM
Bleed @ You dreamnt it!!! : D


LEEE777 - 10/7/2009, 12:05 PM
I'm probably the only person on this site that actually likes Punisher:Warzone, but I do see what he's saying. There were corny elements to both, and I own both movies, but I thought Warzone felt more like an Ennis/Dillon Punisher comic to me than the Tom Jane version. I don't know wtf he's talking about with the "comic book movie" shit. It's based on a f*ckin' comic book! After three efforts, maybe they should just use Frank as an ancillary character in other Marvel movies being that no Punisher fan is satisfied 100% with any of the flicks. Well work is over for the day, so I'm out. Talk to you guys tmrw.
MatchesMalone - 10/7/2009, 12:09 PM
thought so i swear i heard Thomas Jane found dead in his apartment. any way why did they ditch Jane that whole movie was great what made them reboot
bleedthefreak16 - 10/7/2009, 12:10 PM
I think that producers have to understand the character so that they may designate the correct writers and Director for the film.

Thomas Jane is dead on the money. Its just sad the rest of the film crew wasnt.

Hollywood is a joke no wonder we begin to see more talent flowing back into TV and cable series because Hollywood is out of its goddamn mind all that they produce is crap.
Hellmont - 10/7/2009, 12:11 PM
You're right LEEE He IS Punisher! I loved his film. And I think his idea here is great, to give the Punisher that Nolan style reality would be really cool. Just imagine the Crime Drama feel we got from TDK, and take that and turn it even darker and bloodier with Punisher. Idk bout' you, but that makes me feel fuzzy inside hehe... lol
SirExcalibur - 10/7/2009, 12:14 PM
i liked the dolph lundren version the best. there i said it. whatcha gonna do about it?
superdog - 10/7/2009, 12:15 PM
Why would the Punisher try to distance itself from the comic universe where it was created? That makes no sense. I'm all for bringing realism to a CBM, but he just cut down ALL CBMs. That's ridiculous, these are FICTIONAL characters in a FICTIONAL universe. It sounds like he was not a fan of the source material.

If he was so hell bent on not falling into the "goofiness" of CBMs, why did he do a cameo in Spider-Man 2?
MultiPurposePoni - 10/7/2009, 12:19 PM
Yes. The Punisher has stated on many occasions that he has no respect for the costumes. He holds them in contempt. To make a film where he is cast as one of them would be a slap in the face of a great character.
SuperSkrull - 10/7/2009, 12:19 PM
I enjoyed warzone thought ray stevenson did a good job, good b movie.
wheat4 - 10/7/2009, 12:20 PM
I agree with Jane 100%....I am not a big fan of seeing the punisher teaming up with Spider-man or a dancing Peter Parker
HeckYeah - 10/7/2009, 12:21 PM
I feel like the only person who liked Warzone. It wasn't great, but it gets better the more I watch it. I like the action in it. All Punisher movies are great!
screams - 10/7/2009, 12:21 PM
I think Jane's thinking is right-on here. When he says "comicbook" (although Punisher started in comics) he means campy. Although it had more bloodshed or gore, Warzone was still campy. I think he was right to turn it down and Lionsgate wrong to make it.
Phinehas - 10/7/2009, 12:22 PM
The only thing that could save Thomas Jane and the good 2004 film would be to make it a hardcore "sopranos" type series on HBO. It could pick up where 2004 left off with him starring and probably build up enough momentum to make back to the theatre for a sequel eventually.
frankster - 10/7/2009, 12:22 PM
Find you and neuter you!;)

This was Warzone...

Kill. Kill. Swear. Kill. Mumble. A Cliche. Kill Kill. Kill.Swear. Kill. Kill. fade to black.

Is that a movie? Thats a [frick]ing joke! No plot, no character, no NOTHING.
RorMachine - 10/7/2009, 12:23 PM
Sounds like he just wants to play at being Charles Bronson. Didn't the Punisher originate in a Spiderman comic?Shouldn't distance itself too much from the source
FORTAPACHE - 10/7/2009, 12:25 PM
@Phinehas: C'mon man, how can you respect a comment like that? Like you said, when he says "comic book" he means "campy". I would understand that philosophy 5 -10 years ago, but CBMs have come a long way. To use those two words synonymously is an insult to some of the great CBMs we've had lately.
MultiPurposePoni - 10/7/2009, 12:26 PM
@frankster: Jane's already doing an HBO series about a gym teacher with a huge c*ck
MultiPurposePoni - 10/7/2009, 12:28 PM
Understood, MPP. But Hollywood types like Jane who've been in the industry for over 10 years, speak from their own understanding. They undoubtedly loose touch with the "outside" world to varying degrees. Ultimately, I get the context of what he's saying and I love it! More like "Death Wish" or "Taxi Driver"?? That's awesome! Who am I to quibble over a poor choice of words, when I know what he means?
Phinehas - 10/7/2009, 12:31 PM
OH NO HE di-int just blame his movie fail on the comics.

The main thing that is unrealistic about Punisher comics is that the guy never gets killed. Also there's the endless clip and the bad guy can't shoot straight thing, but that's common in popular media.

So of they wanted to make it more realistic, maybe an ass full of lead would be in order instead of dumping on his origin and making the whole damn movie abotu vengence against one guy.

DarthMulder - 10/7/2009, 12:32 PM
Whoa whoa whoa...

Dolph Lundgren killed Punisher way before Jane or Stevenson.

Jane and Stevenson each brought something unique to their roles.

I liked both movies. Yeah, I said it.
ElBicho - 10/7/2009, 12:33 PM
Take care @ MATCHES!

Problem with WARZONE was....

Why bother even bringing in MICRO in his 1st ever movie appearance just to kill him off???

How can a one and a half PUNISHER TASK FORCE capture FRANK that easy after all these years???

JIGSAW was so under used as a character, an again first movie appearance killed off!!!

WARZONE was a waste of space! RAY made a good PUNISHER!! But most of the rest sucked!

This and the use of VENOM makes me real bitter about WOLVERINE!


All three are my most favorite comic book MARVEL characters and all Three was mis-used for the movies!

Lets just hope GREEN LANTERN dont get [frick]ed up, heck it wont, DC does quality these days.

End of the day WARZONE was one of the worst MARVEL movies ever made, and it couldve been one of the best!!

Im a die-hard PUNISHER fan so WARZONE really stunk!

LEEE777 - 10/7/2009, 12:34 PM
@Darth: Amen. That was one of my biggest issues with 2004 Punisher, he learned all these tactics and didn't learn to duck! You can't tell me you wanted to make an uber-realistic movie where you, the actor, takes a shotgun blast to the ribcage and stays standing. It's GOINg to be campy because in real life, Frank would've been dead in the first year.

He didn't want campy? Then why would he light cars on fire in the shape of Punisher skull ala Daredevil?
MultiPurposePoni - 10/7/2009, 12:35 PM
As much I love Ray Stevenson, he was awesome in Rome, warzone waas just bad. I think what he means about warzone being more goof ball was the fact that it had a definite comic book style villain: Jigsaw. I know he's a punisher classic but the reality is you can't survive the accident that created him, and the make up or cg they used to ring him to life in the movie looked just plain bad.
The Jane punisher on the other hand had its goofy comic relief, but almost all action movies have that. To me jane is right when he says punisher isn't exactly your stereotypical comic character. The books, especially he warzone journals, have always tried to portray him more as an action hero than a comic book hero.
There is a definite difference, you can have a comic book about a hero with out the hero being "comicy". And i think punisher movies should alays strive to do that. A person should be able to watch a punisher movie with out ever thinking that it was based on a comic, it should look just like an awesome stalone style action movie, and I don't think that would be a disservice to the character at all.
thwhtGuardian - 10/7/2009, 12:36 PM
He needs to get off his high horse.
ClintEastwood - 10/7/2009, 12:40 PM
To call warzone terrible is a compliment. Jane was a good punisher, and his film paved the way for good, if not great sequels. I don't know why some people hate the first one. You'd be lying if you said you weren't hyped when you saw the russian go against castle. Marvel has it's good moments, but they completely swept punisher under the rug as one of their "dirty little secrets". BS. I love punisher, and they keep bringing him down lower and lower

man i hate hollywood
supermarioworldE - 10/7/2009, 12:41 PM
That being said.. Thomas jane was my favorite Punisher. I like the guy. His acting isn't anything special, but he has a sort of tough guy charisma
DarthMulder - 10/7/2009, 12:41 PM
ROR @ I gotta agree, it would be sweet if he did turn up in another MARVEL Universe movie, FOX'S DAREDEVIL spring to mind, but that cant happen, only Lionsgate Marvel movies, i suppose MAN-THING 2 will have to do lol! : D

Thumbs up, ahhhh makes me wanna see PUNISHER again heh.
LEEE777 - 10/7/2009, 12:42 PM
MPP-He didn't direct it nor produce it. He probably was given more power in his contract, along with promises that the sequel would contain more of what he wanted. Much like Jackman became a producer of Shnick Shnick. But they gave him a big "up yours" and fired him!

I don't really know that for sure. I'm grasping at the wind...
Phinehas - 10/7/2009, 12:42 PM
He sure beats old Dolpho!!!
DarthMulder - 10/7/2009, 12:43 PM
Stevenson was the better Punisher. get with it LEE777
shibazz - 10/7/2009, 12:47 PM
@Phin: Oh, I'm aware of that possibility. I just think it's stupid for him to say that his movie was more realistic in nature than PWZ. He just sounds bitter that they dropped him from the sequel. He's been complaining about this for YEAR. Let it go, hero.

I liked PWZ. It was a B-level action movie and it didn't pretend to be anything but. From the first Red Band trailer we saw, we all new it wasn't going to be a cinematic masterpiece.

After the 2004 Punisher came out, fans were complaining that it was too soft. So they reinvented it. They went too far off the reservation to be taken seriously, but it's what we all asked for.

I believe that another Punisher movie is a waste of time, and I believed that in 2004 as well. I think Frank needs a cable mini-series to be able to delve into character's rich story lines.
MultiPurposePoni - 10/7/2009, 12:48 PM
People here are on crack. Ray Stevenson looks exactly like the fcuking Punisher. Warzone was the embodiement of the Ennis era of Punisher stuff - and that stuff is by far the best out of any of the Punisher material.

The movie may not have been anything great - but it by far was the best and most accurate portrayal of Castle on the screen.

If they had cast Stevenson in Jane's film - and then combined that story with the hardcore violence of Warzone we'd have a masterpiece.

People need to stop raggin on Warzone. And oh yeah - Castle isn't showing up in any other Marvel film. Don't count on that sh!t - ever.
Keven - 10/7/2009, 12:50 PM
Even though Ray Stevenson was physically a more accurate Punisher, Tom Jane was hands down a better one. His movie was a great kickoff point, and Warzone took a giant dump on that.
antz1104 - 10/7/2009, 12:52 PM
A tv series would be perfect Multi, something on hbo. Punisher really lends himself more to an episodic format than a movie, it's just the nature of his character.
thwhtGuardian - 10/7/2009, 12:53 PM
I think what he means by "comic book movie" is a sense of unreality, things that are not physically possible or lean more towards a sense of fantasy. To me it sounds like he doesn't want it to be comic bookish, more like it is reality.

I could be wrong but thats what it seems like he is saying, which I agree with in the case of the Punisher.
JerusalemJr - 10/7/2009, 12:55 PM
He's right Warzone did bring in more of the comic element. THey had people heads blowin off and shit. Jigsaw could have been less comicy.

IDK I really would like to see Punisher team up with another hero in a movie though.
StrangemannX09 - 10/7/2009, 12:55 PM
yep MPP, a Punisher cable series for def is the way to go, I want them to do flashbacks to the Born storyline too!
FORTAPACHE - 10/7/2009, 12:55 PM
I liked Jane's Punisher much more that War Zone. I think if they had went with his take on the character (to an extent mind you) and did a dark dark film it would have been great. The second could have concentrated on his one man war on crime resulting in a much more violent film. Or what if you didn't see him at all and two cops were trying to solve murders he was responsible for and it was more like the Departed. they could Toddy Mac to write it and make toys.
weapon925 - 10/7/2009, 12:58 PM
They should just get Ryan Reynolds and be done with it....just kiddin
HeckYeah - 10/7/2009, 12:58 PM
The best character that would work as a tv series would be Daredevil. Matt being a Lawyer/Daredevil would be great as a new version of Law & Order.
StrangemannX09 - 10/7/2009, 1:00 PM
Why do people keep on mentioning Ennis's Punisher and that [frick]ing travesty of a movie ion the same post?? They are nothing alike! Ennis wrote STORIES with PLOTS, his characters had more than 1 dimensions, he didn't have Jigsaw become a [frick]ing Dick Tracy villain, he didn't have Micro killed in his first appearance. And most importantly, his work on the Punisher had an insight into vigilantism, it wasn't just mindless violence all of the time. So what if Ray looked like Castle! He sucked ass! He had about as much charisma and screen presence as a wardrobe. Oh but he shot lots of things didn't he? Well, if thats all you want, take it, its yours.
RorMachine - 10/7/2009, 1:02 PM
thwhtknight and MPP-

At this point of the game, I heartily agree. And yes, he is bitter. He fell in love with that character as Jackman, Shnick Shnick! I don't fault him for that. But I think movies would make a better medium. But thats over now. Too many foul ups to go straight into reboot.

Well said, Ror.
Phinehas - 10/7/2009, 1:04 PM
@ Rorshach01: ok...it's oook...take a deep breath, and Calm down.
StrangemannX09 - 10/7/2009, 1:07 PM
@Ror: Just wondering, how do you know how much charisma Frank Castle is supposed to have by reading about him in a comic? It's not like you have a vocal reference. When you read a comic, your own voice substitutes the characters'. So really it's your personal interpretation of how the characters would sound and their dynamic with each other.

From what I recall from Ennis' run, Frank always looked pissed off and broody. I can't tell you how much of a charisma vibe I get from a guy that methodically kills people. Tom Cruise has charisma. . . Frank Castle has anger issues.
MultiPurposePoni - 10/7/2009, 1:08 PM
War Zone was not bad at all. Much better than Jane's version. It was also no worse than Daredevil, Elektra, Ghost Rider or FF2 Rise of the Silver Surfer. I would def go see a War Zone 2 especially if it had Hitman, Moon Knight or The Hood in it.

Khonshu - 10/7/2009, 1:08 PM
Ror..........sheesh.

I'm a huge Ennis fan...Of course his books were better - he had time to develop the characters...Remember now - this was a half cocked 'adaptation' (lol)....that some chick thought would work on screen in an hour and a half.

sure the acting wasn't good - but you can't tell me that some of Ennis' sh!t isn't batsh!t crazy and over the top.

eg. "The boys" - every issue.
2nd. Arseface
3rd. Punisher k!lls the Marvel Universe
4th. guy having sex with meat shrine

- I could really go on and on and on. lol.....I love it all - but you have to admit Ennis does over the top crazy sh!t - he just does it better than this movie ever could.
Keven - 10/7/2009, 1:10 PM
yeah I think you're right ror, the director mistook gritty to mean exploding heads. Grit is an emotional thing as well it isn't just violence and warzone was lacking that. I was really disappointed by ray, he did such a great job as the wounded and troubled soldier in Rome that he seemed to be a natural fit for the punisher. I guess it just comes down to story, Rome had it in spades, and Punisher swapped it out for mindless gore.
thwhtGuardian - 10/7/2009, 1:13 PM
OUT OF ALL THE PUNISHER MOVIES, I LIKED THOMAS JANE'S..I HONESTLY WOULD HAVE BEEN VERY PISSED IF HE DIDNT HAVE THE ICONIC SKULL ON A BULLET PROOF VEST. WARZONE WENT FOR COMIC BOOK LOOK, RATED ARE VIOLENCE AND THE GUY THEY GOT TO PLAY HIM LOOKED DEAD ON LIKE A BRADSTREET COVER..BUT WHY DID FANS NOT LIKE IT? IT WAS PRETTY CLOSE TO THE COMIC LOOK, BUT WHAT JANE DID APPEALED MORE TO PEOPLE, I MEAN YOU HAVE YOUR DOLPH LUDGREN ONE THAT WAS WAY OFF-THEN YOU HAVE YOUR THOMAS JANE ONE WICH HAD YOU PSYCHOLOGICALLY CUED IN ON WHY HE DOES IT, YOUR INVESTED, AND THE SMART WAY HE GETS BACK YOU GOTTA ADMIT WAS PRETTY DAMN COOL...YOU HAVE YOUR WARZONE WICH WAS COMIC BOOK BUT FOR SOME REASON PEOPLE DIDNT TAKE TO IT SO MUCH..FOR ME, GIVE ME WHAT THOMAS JANE HAS BUT WHAT WARZONE HAD WITH LOOK, THATS A SEGWAY I CAN SAY WOULD WORK..
GUNSMITH - 10/7/2009, 1:14 PM
@ Keven: YES, ARSEFACE!!! Loved him but Cassidy was the man.
antz1104 - 10/7/2009, 1:19 PM
I would say that "Grit" is an unwavering philosophical resolve that when tested, holds it form and true nature.
Phinehas - 10/7/2009, 1:19 PM
@Phin: Like jello?
MultiPurposePoni - 10/7/2009, 1:22 PM
They should have just taken "Welcome Back Frank" or "In the Beginning" and adapted it verbatum. Unfortunately now it'll be at least a decade until they reboot the series b/c no one wants to touch it. (It could always join Walking Dead on AMC..)
antz1104 - 10/7/2009, 1:23 PM
Only the top skin when left uncovered to solidify.

Oh crap! I left that one wide open! Arrggghhh! I did it again!
Phinehas - 10/7/2009, 1:25 PM
Ror, Nice article man. I get what he's saying and I agree with him that PWZ took a step backwards from the reality aspect. In PWZ I caught myself rolling my eyes at several moments. Jane kicked as as Frank Castle, and if he were a bit taller, he'd be another actor to catch my vote for Captain America.
TheMyth - 10/7/2009, 1:26 PM
@Phin: Dude, did you see that guy telling me to step on a roadside bomb over at the WW article? That makes three people on this site that want me to die in proper military fashion LOL
MultiPurposePoni - 10/7/2009, 1:27 PM
Poni, I was talking about the actor having charisma, not the character. An actor needs to be able to make even the most stoney faces, miserable bastard like Castle identifiable..that takes charisma, Ray didn't have it..in Warzone, I have heard he is great in Rome so maybe the fault was his direction.

Kev, boys, sorry i guess i did get a bit over the top there! I'm just tired of hearing people defend that movie as being faithful..it was in no way faithful. Yes, Ennis does go waaaay over the top in his comics, even to the point of me actually thinking its too far sometimes, but, he is also a great story teller. And he knows how to make his characters likable..even when they are being complete bastards. Warzone was only the over the top bits with none of the good stuff.

Cheers Myth, yeah I know Warzone was more comic booky, but I still think Janes movie, while better, was more comic reliefy. I mean, just look at those 2 clowns they got as his neighbors?
RorMachine - 10/7/2009, 1:28 PM
That's what I was trying to get at phin, it's more than just violence which is all warzone gave us.
For all its faults jane's punisher tried to give us an emotional handle on the character, you understood his motives and his methods. Where as in ray's punisher all we got were some explosions. All though I have to say that I enjoyed the reporter in warzone.
And I think a law and order: hell's kitchen would be a great show. half an hour of tights and crime, half an hour of courtroom drama with Matt.
thwhtGuardian - 10/7/2009, 1:29 PM
@ Multi now you know you're in the club
antz1104 - 10/7/2009, 1:29 PM
@Ror: I don't know about that, man. Stevenson reminded me of ALOT of old, angry Marines that I've known. It was a near perfect imitation. I swear then create them with cookie cutters.
MultiPurposePoni - 10/7/2009, 1:31 PM
@antz1104: I didn't even get a t-shirt. You guys are so lame
MultiPurposePoni - 10/7/2009, 1:31 PM
MPP- Yeah, that's pretty screwed up. Odds are he's a dumb little kid. I think his apology was sincere. But he should know (especially with fam) not to make cracks like that to combat vets. He may experience a harder lesson in the future than your rebuke.
Phinehas - 10/7/2009, 1:33 PM
@Phin: Hahaha I just love how people think that it hurts our feeelings! 'Roadside Bomb' sounds so scary that it MUST be a good insult! Please
MultiPurposePoni - 10/7/2009, 1:35 PM
Multi: you don't want one, it's got the arrow and says "I'm with stupid".
antz1104 - 10/7/2009, 1:35 PM
@antz1104: That's alright, I've already got one. But mine has an arrow pointing downward and it says "The little guy's with me"
MultiPurposePoni - 10/7/2009, 1:37 PM
@ Rorschach01: Man, if there's one thing you and I agree on, it's that War Zone was shit. Don't listen to them. Let the hate flow. That movie deserves it.

@ LEEE777: I didn't care for Wolverine Origins either, but I think War Zone was far worse. It was worse than X3 and Hulk combined. Never have I watched a movie and felt truly angry for wasting my time.
BmanHall - 10/7/2009, 1:37 PM
Him not being in Warzone is the reason i wont watch it, and judging from all the feedback about WarZone on this post im pretty happy i didnt
Cape - 10/7/2009, 1:38 PM
Jane was the better punisher and it was the better movie - but yeah, the first movie was more 'comical' I'd have said.

I think some professional film reviewers have said it too.
SoulAllFlush - 10/7/2009, 1:38 PM
Indeed.
Phinehas - 10/7/2009, 1:38 PM
@Bman: The way your avatar looks at me tickles my pickle
MultiPurposePoni - 10/7/2009, 1:39 PM
there's a difference between comical and campy though, and warzone was the latter. It had a freakin dick tracy like villain and its gore was so rampant that it was almost comical. All it needed was self serving references like a punisher themed master card and I would've sworn shumaker was involved.
thwhtGuardian - 10/7/2009, 1:43 PM
MPP-

"I just love how people think that it hurts our feeelings!"

Maybe so. But one of these days, he's going to come across a guy who had seen his best buddy vaporized. When he cracks another stupid remark, that guy will introduce him to the sound of another crack. lol
Phinehas - 10/7/2009, 1:48 PM
MPP- Oh stop provoking rises ;P You know damn well how much charisma a certain character has even if he's from a comic book. It has to do with his personality which should be well written by gifted professional writers. THAT makes charisma. The way he acts and retorts. Or else, what's the difference between Deadpool and Punisher aside from the healing factor??? They both have charisma in their own unique way. It's what "makes" the character. It's the same story with Lobo. Why the hell would anyone want a big guy that has the charisma of a turnip??? You NEED Jeffrey Dean Morgan for Lobo!!!



As for Punisher, Tom Jane is the perfect example of a WORTHY actor for a comic book film. I totally 110% agree with what he said even though i would have chosen other words to use. It doesn't go for EVERY character. But it suits Punisher even more than Batman. How can you get angry at his choice of words when all you see in Frank Castle are "angre issues"??? You seem to not sleep enough lately LOL :P
Shaman - 10/7/2009, 1:51 PM
I hope everyone here realizes, there wil NEVER be ANY comic book movie that completly satisfies every fan-boy (or Fan-girl)! PERIOD! That is just the way it is, and yes, we can all argue our points, but really, who is gonna win someone over that has already made up their mind?

Personally, I enjoyed WarZone. I thought it had great entertainment value, and Ray Stevenson was fcuking SPOT ON! I mean seriously, other than the fact that Punisher is DEEPLY mentally and emotionally disturbed because of what happened to his family, he is NOT a deep character. Don't get me wrong, I did like Tomas Jane's Punisher also, but what we have here are two different takes on the same based character. WarZone was for the fans who complained about the first one not being violent enough for Punisher. That's it.
WulfComicFan - 10/7/2009, 1:55 PM
meh, all the punisher's lacked something.

Oh yeah, being good.

Its hard to capture all that is Frank Castle and put it up on the screen.

Tom has a point, really, if you could capture what Heath did with the Joker(The psychosis, jaded and cold calculating unpredictability less the "flamboyant") , and do that with Frank, we would have one [frick]ing bad ass movie.

The opening scene with Dolph meditating in a candle lit sewer...is about as close to what I imagined Punisher should have been. You literally should have the entire movie narrated by Frank, with very little onscreen dialogue. Only capturing what his thoughts are.

I always found the most intense Punisher panels are just frank and his thoughts. I.E Born. Most of that series is exactly like that. This IMO hits it SPOT.ON

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Eyt4wV-TjMY

I found Tom's version too "human", lets face it, Frank is a [frick]ing animal. This they somewhat corrected in War Zone, but it was still too campy and predicable.

TheJester - 10/7/2009, 2:04 PM
Jester- Frank is not a freakin' animal. Wolverine is. Sabertooth is. Frank isn't all "primal rage" and shit. He IS a human that has lost all he had and wishes to right the wrongs of society by using the stone age law of vengeance by any means necessary. Jane captured that PERFECTLY.
Shaman - 10/7/2009, 2:09 PM
He really did Shaman. He wasn't perfect, but what adaption is? Unlike Warzone, which was all violence, you actually felt for Jane's Punisher. There was a conscious effort through out that movie to balance the action of punisher with the humanity of the punisher, and I think they succeed.
thwhtGuardian - 10/7/2009, 2:14 PM
Punisher: War Zone pwned, it was the perfect punisher movie, and it was spot on to the MAX comics. the director made the film for herself and to the true fans of the violent and gruesome punisher
hellenkeller420 - 10/7/2009, 2:20 PM
Id like to see Thomas Jane return as The Punisher - however, im not too fussed on seeing another Punisher movie. In all honesty theres not much that can be done with the character beyond what they've already done in the first average and second awful movies!
JoshW - 10/7/2009, 2:23 PM
thwhtknight- Great comment! The very reason why we fans relate so much to comic book characters is for the "humanity" that is attached to these characters. In a comic book, Frank has all the time in the world to be as violent as endearing. That's impossible in a 2 hour movie or less. Jane did what he needed to do which was make the "movie goers" relate to his character. All War Zone did was show the "bang bang hobby" that Frank took up professionaly. It IS the same thing with Rambo. If you didn't see the human aspect that Stalone brought to his character and tryed to hide it while he was being the best at what he did, then we would not have gotten 4 films and soon to be 5.
Shaman - 10/7/2009, 2:26 PM
How bout they get the fella that directed Taken to direct a new Punisher Movie...??
manofsteel71 - 10/7/2009, 2:32 PM
WTF is jane out of his mind, distance a comic book character from the comics? not only was his version of punisher crap it was the most action less action film ever dolph lungdren's version of the punisher was better and as for zany and goofy WTF does he call that bag of cheeseball shit The mutant choronicles a masterpeice in his eyes no doubt! P.S Warzone was a decent film
deanlegend - 10/7/2009, 2:33 PM
I loved Jane's Punisher, and the whole movie as a matter of fact. Well, except Travolta, but the rest of the movie was great IMO.

Have avoided War Zone like the plague, don't plan on watching it any time soon!
InTylerWeTrust82 - 10/7/2009, 2:35 PM
was the first Mad Max film based on the punisher?this isn't a loaded question btw!
FORTAPACHE - 10/7/2009, 2:39 PM
I guess there's no pleasing some people deanlegend. But if you take the time to read other people's posts you'll see that it is commonly believed that he meant that the character should stay away from being campy rather than meaning that it should stay away from it's source material.
And on the subject of mutant chronicals, it was meant to be an old b-movie scifi in the vain of grind house and planet terror. It's a real niche film and if you're not into that than you're not but that's what it was supposed to be.
thwhtGuardian - 10/7/2009, 2:43 PM
@ MultiPurposePoni: All for you bro. =D


BmanHall - 10/7/2009, 2:48 PM
I might be the minority here... but I liked Punisher Warzone, because of TITUS PULLO!

... and I second shaman for Morgan in Lobo



access - 10/7/2009, 2:55 PM
What happened to Sparkles? He probably fell asleep on his keys. LOL
Phinehas - 10/7/2009, 2:57 PM


Lol @ I never put WARZONE was better than BORIGINS, i was talking about that other X-Movie called X (bloody) 3!

; p
LEEE777 - 10/7/2009, 3:01 PM
@Phin: I should beat you with a garden hose until you sh*t fertilizer
MultiPurposePoni - 10/7/2009, 3:01 PM
If that's what you're into, please consult with Shaman.
Phinehas - 10/7/2009, 3:04 PM
He's bringing the gag ball. . pucker up
MultiPurposePoni - 10/7/2009, 3:07 PM

Phinehas - 10/7/2009, 3:10 PM
That retard has nothing on me. I'd make her drink the lotion too
MultiPurposePoni - 10/7/2009, 3:15 PM
Jane talks sense the last punisher movie sucked salted balls it was by far one of the worst cbm ever to be placed on to film it's up there with the unreleased fantastic four film. the punisher is a hardass killer who needs to be treated like so he kicks the shit out of people first and doesn't bother asking questions. They should so make a decent punisher movie and have Castle fight baracudda or a black ops team. Now that i would pay to see
Deadpaul - 10/7/2009, 3:15 PM
@Deadpaul: "the punisher is a hardass killer who needs to be treated like so he kicks the shit out of people first and doesn't bother asking questions."

Ummm. . . so what exactly didn't you like about about War Zone?
MultiPurposePoni - 10/7/2009, 3:18 PM
I liked Punisher:Warzone myself but I didn't appreciate the
camp whatsoever! But I liked the "finally" ultra-violent
Punisher! But I sure would have loved Jane to have starred
in it! I liked the first Punisher except for John Travolta!
It should have been darker like Warzone. And Warzone should
have had a different director. That German woman screwed
the pooch. Why did she think you have to put camp in a
comic book movie. What is she stuck in the 80's?
DDD - 10/7/2009, 3:20 PM

Phinehas - 10/7/2009, 3:21 PM
I liked WZ....his one had all the cliche comical shit in it...at least WZ felt like a Punisher movie not a film about a guy who gets shot at a bbq then rents an apartment with 3 dumbass characters that dance to opera..(oh how i laughed) meanwile Travolta produces one of his worst perfomances just in time to listen to some guy play the guitar cus christ heaven forbid they give a bit of action.....Jane sucked...lol :P
teabag - 10/7/2009, 3:24 PM

Phinehas - 10/7/2009, 3:24 PM
War Zone was bad. It was handled wrong in its direction I thought, Lexi, bless her, was more wanting to make the film look like a comic panel than make the story and direction of the actors feel real in their skins. West mutilated Jigsaw he and Jim were as someone said earlier "Dick Tracy Villians," I think of them more as the Dick Tracy villian's Flat Top child born of anal rape by Sin City's Kevin , and in the end you get... a psychotic Tommy Lee Jones style hyper campy hyper violent Two-Face for Jigsaw with an accent and overacting so bad it put the worst of Batman Nipples era to shame.

Frank is devoid of humanity. He has killed that within himself and in the rare cases he is confronted by human emotion creeping up on him he feels real fear because he can't do what he does and hate that strongly and still be human. He kills that part of himself before it kills him. Ennis was great about showing that removal from self.

The movies need Franks narration, it is the one thing that neither of the recent Punisher movies have gone in depth with, but with a character like Frank who might say ten lines in a movie the narration of his thoughts and reasoning is less of a story cope out and more of a necessity. Without it we really don't get a feel of who Frank is aside from the blank slated killing machine.

No supervillains. Despite being a comic character Frank doesn't really inhabit that world. He culls the herd the pushers and pimps, rapists and street thugs that characters like Daredevil and Spidey are really too under matched to bother with. Punisher never seems more out of place than when he is put beside some asshole with lightening bolts coming out of his head... He'd just shoot the guy.

The writing needs to be real. Ennis has a great flare for character and quirks, humor where there is humor should only come from character reactions not slap stick.

The action needs to be reality based; real military tactics put against armatures, efficiency. Harsh and final. The man wastes no energy. The feel of it should be more on lines with what we saw in the film version of A History of Violence. Realism is far more disturbing to see than heads exploding. Go back and watch the dinner scene if you don't buy that. No taking out Free Runners with a heat seeker... so stupid.

The world just needs to be as it is. The location should just be the worst drug infested most dangerous areas of New York. Not some hyper stylized neon churched nightmare.
I really think a true Punisher movie, done well would have the feel of a Deathwish or a great revenge movie from the 70's. I agree with Jane on that. I have loved the Punisher since I was a kid and I doubt there is anyone who wants to see him brought to the screen in a way that respects the character and the book more than me. I think of a Punisher directed by John Milius, based on a story by Garth Ennis and drool.

nerosday - 10/7/2009, 3:27 PM
I thought it was just way too much like a harder version of Batman and Robin. Jigsaw was way over the top and the scene at the begining when he shoots all the mob bosses at the table wtf is it too much to ask to have a bit of realism in a movie even be it a comic movie. I felt utterly let down by a person who has never made a movie before. Give them something easier to do. Everybody knows that the comic book world are very very protective of their heroes and characters and to give a job of this size to an ameture is crazy. the director is a former kickboxing champion how does this industry even paralell that one there completly different. There's enough source material out there for even a grad student to make a decent movie out of with out all the campness and colourful images the only thing that was missing was punisher nipples. I know everyone has to start somewhere in an industry just do it on something no one cares about like a hawkman movie
Deadpaul - 10/7/2009, 3:27 PM
oh and the bit in the kitchen why god why every one's that is humanly possible
Deadpaul - 10/7/2009, 3:31 PM
@Deadpaul: You referred to Shumacher. . . no matter what is said on these posts never, NEVER use Shumacher as a reference.

Automatic 10 point deduction.
MultiPurposePoni - 10/7/2009, 3:32 PM
Good points, but I wouldn't be too critical of Lexi. There have been three Punisher movies so far and none of them have come close to hitting the mark

Maybe I should write a Punisher script. . .
MultiPurposePoni - 10/7/2009, 3:35 PM
Yeah, Deadpaul. There was a united CBM council back in May of 2006. No one is permitted to mention that name anymore. Not even in jest. Only a casual mention as "the previous director of the batman films" will be tolerated. If you're not careful, Galactus will boot you to the curb.
Phinehas - 10/7/2009, 3:36 PM
i was well gutted when i heard tom jane was not gonna be making another one and they was gonna , remake, but iwas highly surprised, i really enjoyed war zone, i even like jig saw, thort his brother stole the show.
no i loved the action in it, i guess i know what he saying, question is really which punisher could tie in with avengers if it could happen, i like im both and would love to see sequals on bothe films. tought one for me they are both worthy being along side cap and iron man
Rolanddeschain19 - 10/7/2009, 3:36 PM
Luffy@.......






lol :P
teabag - 10/7/2009, 3:36 PM
lol!sweet!
FORTAPACHE - 10/7/2009, 3:39 PM
i apologize for blashpmy but the point had to be made.
Deadpaul - 10/7/2009, 3:40 PM
@ ror

at the end of spidey 2, you can actually see the punisher standing in the background when mary jane is running through the park. its tom jane, he even admitted in an issue of Wizard. there were a lot of skeptics, because the movie rights weren't owned by the same company. you can't see the skull, but its the punisher for sure. kinda cool i thought
CorndogBurglar - 10/7/2009, 3:41 PM
as a new member to the cbm world i was unaware of these rules and regulations they should be in the terms and conditions when you sign up
Deadpaul - 10/7/2009, 3:41 PM
@ Tea.... LOL..!!
manofsteel71 - 10/7/2009, 3:43 PM
@ superdog

i don't know if your being serious, but i liked lundgrens punisher the best too. it actually captured the tone of the punisher comics better than the other too. warzone was too campy, and jane's punisher just felt too light hearted and not dark enough. if you combine warzone with jane's punisher, you have the perfect punisher movie though.

its funny, because you would wonder how you can possible mess up a punisher movie, yet hollywood has found a way.
CorndogBurglar - 10/7/2009, 3:43 PM
Deadpaul-Thats the only one. You're given only one warning.
Phinehas - 10/7/2009, 3:45 PM
check it out CBM'ers, the jane/punisher is the guy in black that turns and looks at mary jane. he's wearing all black and a trench coat.


CorndogBurglar - 10/7/2009, 3:46 PM
wow that's a tight ship. what else am i NOT allowed to mention? just so i know for the future? i don't want galactus' big boot hitting me it'll leave a mark
Deadpaul - 10/7/2009, 3:48 PM
i'm very delicate. like a tulip
Deadpaul - 10/7/2009, 3:48 PM
Dolph were making a punisher movie..."duh does he die" no Dolph but were gonna kill other people " if they die...they die!!!!....what about da skull on da chest?"....No no no Dolph we think the comic fans will apreciate it more if we scrap that and put tiny skulls on kitchen knifes......BOX OFFICE GOLD...." If it flops i will break you!! " :P
teabag - 10/7/2009, 3:48 PM
TEA @ LMFAO!!! ; D

Corndog @ I think even JANE himself believed that even though he was never there, thats what he said, but then again it could [frick]ing be him!!
LEEE777 - 10/7/2009, 3:49 PM
TEA @





>




LEEE777 - 10/7/2009, 3:54 PM
yeah that does look like him!
FORTAPACHE - 10/7/2009, 3:56 PM
@ Rolanddeschain19: Whoa whoa whoa [frick]ing whoa... His brother stole the show? Loony Bin [frick]ing Jim? Please God, tell me you're kidding...
BmanHall - 10/7/2009, 3:57 PM
CORN @ I thought he joked about it, but that was on E-NEWS or something years ago!

Cool man!
LEEE777 - 10/7/2009, 3:57 PM
@ LEEE

i know its bad quality, but its definately him. he's admitted it. watch the bluray or dvd, and you can tell its jane. he's on the right hand side of the screen and turns and looks at MJ
CorndogBurglar - 10/7/2009, 3:59 PM
The sad thing is,, ive got all three PUNISHER movies on DVD lol! ; D
LEEE777 - 10/7/2009, 4:00 PM
If you judge the end of 2004's Punisher with the slicked backed hair and monologue, I think it would have gone more Bradstreet in a sequel than the first installment. IMO
Phinehas - 10/7/2009, 4:01 PM
@ LEEE

yep, they couldn't say its him in the movie, or show the skull or anything because they would have gotten their asses sued off, but its pretty obvious that its supposed to be punisher. plus, the punisher wouldn't be walking around in broad daylight in central park flashing his skull around like a moron, y'know?
CorndogBurglar - 10/7/2009, 4:01 PM
Dolph only likes the missionary position...anything else is a sin....fact..lol



teabag - 10/7/2009, 4:01 PM
@ LEEE

i own them all too, lol.
CorndogBurglar - 10/7/2009, 4:03 PM
@ tea

what about the classic lundgren film called "I Come In Peace". best line ever...

Alien - "I come in peace..."

Lundgren - "and you're going in pieces"
lol
CorndogBurglar - 10/7/2009, 4:04 PM
Dolph we have a great film called Masters of the Universe.." Does he die?...".......No but the audiance will !! Lol


CD@ Is that what it was called in the US...here it was called Dark Angel :)
teabag - 10/7/2009, 4:06 PM
@ tea

yeah man, it was called i come in peace. i don't care man, when i was little those corny movies were so cool, now its like a nostalgia thing for me.

on a side note, dark angel was a show with jessica alba as the star, i think it was her first real job. i don't know if you had that there, so i thought i'd share
CorndogBurglar - 10/7/2009, 4:10 PM
i think that film was called Dark Angel Corndog,Tea is right, bloody woefull!
FORTAPACHE - 10/7/2009, 4:11 PM
Yeah i know the series CD but the Dolph movie came out years before that......i never understand why they change movie titles for the Brits? :P
teabag - 10/7/2009, 4:12 PM
@ fortapache


CorndogBurglar - 10/7/2009, 4:12 PM
I personally liked "I Come In Peace". It was corny but cool!
DDD - 10/7/2009, 4:13 PM
Im in Scotland Tea so I know that film as Dark Angel too
FORTAPACHE - 10/7/2009, 4:14 PM
lol, notice the "I" in quotes. eerie, i know.

didn't realize that pic was so big, lol sorry
CorndogBurglar - 10/7/2009, 4:14 PM
I forgot about the flying disc tho lol!
FORTAPACHE - 10/7/2009, 4:15 PM
i saw he man the other day made me want chicken
Deadpaul - 10/7/2009, 4:17 PM
Forte@ Dark Angel sounds better so i guess we were lucky lol



teabag - 10/7/2009, 4:18 PM
I liked all three, but all were lacking, as is almost every other movie EVER made, so why complain, just sit back and enjoy the ride. If you don't expect too much, than you can't really be disapointed.
WulfComicFan - 10/7/2009, 4:18 PM
how does a poozer get noticed unless he gets in your face?
Deadpaul - 10/7/2009, 4:18 PM
@Deadpaul You're looking for rules? Here's one: Poozers shouldn't interrupt when there's serious ring slinging going on. Sit back and learn from the pros
MultiPurposePoni - 10/7/2009, 4:19 PM
lol!still didn't quite dodge the bullet tho!;)
FORTAPACHE - 10/7/2009, 4:20 PM
Stepping up isn't the problem, it's having the will to get back up after you've been handed your ass

Good attitude. You'll fit in nicely
MultiPurposePoni - 10/7/2009, 4:20 PM
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