SPIDER-MAN 4: Marvel Studios Reportedly Sets Shooting Start Date - But Have They Found A Director Yet?
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SPIDER-MAN 4: Marvel Studios Reportedly Sets Shooting Start Date - But Have They Found A Director Yet?

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Kurne
Kurne - 1/3/2021, 5:44 AM
I can't believe it's been 6 years since that big announcement of the Sony-Marvel deal. I still remember opening it up here clear as day.
Blergh
Blergh - 1/3/2021, 6:21 AM
@Kurne - Same, old account back then but it was magical hearing these news.
Fares
Fares - 1/3/2021, 7:07 AM
@Kurne - I remember taking my daily morning shit before going to school when I opened my phone and saw it. The moment I read the headline, a doodoo splashed on the water surface and my heart skipped a beat.
EMagnusPhoenix
EMagnusPhoenix - 1/3/2021, 8:27 AM
@Fares -
Fares
Fares - 1/3/2021, 9:18 AM
@EMagnusPhoenix - Hey I say it as it is
bman263
bman263 - 1/3/2021, 5:47 AM
Happy for the guy.
InfinitePunches
InfinitePunches - 1/3/2021, 6:20 AM
Remember when they cancelled this movie briefly? Good on Holland for fighting the suits.
Nightwing1015
Nightwing1015 - 1/3/2021, 6:36 AM
@InfinitePunches - I think it was more fan reaction that anything else. Most people weren't on Disney's side once they heard the full story IIRC
Tonic24k
Tonic24k - 1/3/2021, 3:20 PM
@Nightwing1015 - And more people were on Sony's side? Hardly
Nightwing1015
Nightwing1015 - 1/3/2021, 3:26 PM
@Tonic24k - Um yeah they definitely were. The majority of Reddit were certainly on Sony's side. This is one example. It had like 50K upvotes at the time

Tonic24k
Tonic24k - 1/3/2021, 5:45 PM
@Nightwing1015 - This is just confirmation bias. There were PLENTY of people not in support of this. Also, this meme is a bad argument and doesn't consider Spider-Man actually being a Marvel IP.

https://comicbook.com/marvel/news/spider-man-fans-push-back-sony-social-media-accounts-boycott-save-spiderman-marvel-deal/#8
Nightwing1015
Nightwing1015 - 1/3/2021, 6:16 PM
@Tonic24k - Oh 100% yeah people were initially completely against Sony. It was only the week after when we got more details leaked that people started realising it was Marvel's fault.

And yeah I agree that particular meme isn't a great argument but the general principle is definitely true - Disney was getting greedy
Tonic24k
Tonic24k - 1/3/2021, 6:20 PM
@Nightwing1015 - Greedy to work with their own IP?... That's some ironic shit. Lol
Nightwing1015
Nightwing1015 - 1/4/2021, 4:58 AM
@Tonic24k - Well I guess technically it is their own IP but they didn't own the film rights and started becoming unreasonably demanding. What they didn't realise is that Sony could easily walk away. They had some pretty big Spidey successes with Venom and Spiderverse so that certainly gave them the power in that situation.
Tonic24k
Tonic24k - 1/4/2021, 9:02 AM
@Nightwing1015 - The film rights here is a glorified licensing situation. And it happened when Marvel wasn't even thinking of doing their own films. Now that the MCU exists, Spider-Man deserves to be in it and Sony is holding the property hostage.

Personally, I think Marvel should negotiate that Sony does all animated projects while Marvel Studios get all their characters under one roof for MCU storytelling. Sony pioneered that animation style for ITSV; that's their lane. And shit, even if they took over the What If project for future installments that could work out for both parties. Or hell, give them a bunch of the Fox properties they acquired. But Venom wasn't received as well as it would've been if Marvel Studios produced it. It had decent box office success but tying it in with proper storytelling based on source material would've made it a much better film. Or better yet, part of the MCU's Spider-Man story arc.

With this said, I don't think any of Marvel Studios' demands could be considered unreasonable. They made higher grossing SM films than Sony ever did and finally took the character over $1B. Not to mention...it's their property to begin with. The only film Sony made that could be argued to be better is SM2. SM1 was pretty good, SM3 was awful, and the reboot and its sequel were a collective abomination.
Nightwing1015
Nightwing1015 - 1/4/2021, 9:49 AM
@Tonic24k - "it's their property to begin with"

That honestly makes no difference in the business world though. Marvel were on the verge of bankrupcy and selling the film rights back in the 90s is what made the MCU possible. So Marvel don't get to complain about Sony "holding it hostage". It was a consensual transaction that allowed them to invest in the most profitable film franchise of all time, I don't exactly think it's unfair to Marvel.

And when you adjust for inflation, Sony's original Spider-Man films outperformed Marvel's. 1 billion today is not as impressive a gross as 900 million was in 2007.
Tonic24k
Tonic24k - 1/4/2021, 11:11 AM
@Nightwing1015 - I'm in the business world. I know how it works. Deals aren't meant to last forever. They're typically conditional to account for variable factors. And Marvel isn't complaining, they're pursuing. Which they have every right to do. No one ever imagined a Marvel Studios ever being formed back then, let alone soaring to become the most successful film franchise in history. By a staggering margin, too. What ISN'T "business" is to let another company tell you you're never getting your IP back.

Marvel Studios has proved they have the ability to make quality CBMs consistently. Nothing they've produced has flopped and even their worst films are reviewed relatively well. Some folks will say Captain Marvel was an awful film yet it made over $1B. They've got the juice! Sony had their chance and lost their footing after 2 films. That's the reality. So really, Sony doesn't have a good reason to maintain their stubbornness. They're not making good Spidey films.

However, they found success with ITSV. So once again, that's their lane. They need to focus on their strengths instead of trying to be what the MCU is.
Nightwing1015
Nightwing1015 - 1/4/2021, 12:45 PM
@Tonic24k - "What ISN'T "business" is to let another company tell you you're never getting your IP back."

Why? Sony are completely within their legal rights to do that. Marvel consensually sold their film rights to them. When you sell something you accept you are transfering property rights. Why would they expect to ever get them back?

"So really, Sony doesn't have a good reason to maintain their stubbornness. They're not making good Spidey films."

And yet they had two extreme successes in the form of Venom and Spider-Verse in the last few years alone. I agree with you that Marvel produce better films but that doesn't appear to matter at the box office! Those successes solidify Sony's position and prove that they don't really NEED Marvel which means Marvel couldn't afford to become too demanding.
Nightwing1015
Nightwing1015 - 1/4/2021, 12:46 PM
But yeah, agreed, they need to stop trying to be the MCU.
Tonic24k
Tonic24k - 1/4/2021, 1:29 PM
@Nightwing1015 - I wouldn't call Venom an extreme success. It's nowhere near the caliber of a Marvel Studios film and its reviews are super meh. Marvel can absolutely be as demanding as they want to be. They're in a position of much more power despite Sony shielding themselves with a contractual agreement.

Yes, Sony has the legal right to play stubborn. But again, contracts are not meant to be forever. As times change, as interests change, agreements are renegotiated to continue to make sense for both parties. They also did not SELL the film rights to Sony. They negotiated a licensing agreement. This is an important distinguishing factor. Based on the original agreement, Sony had to make a Spider-Man film every 6 years in order to honor the deal. Otherwise, film rights reverted back to Marvel. If Sony OWNED the film rights, they would have no such stipulation. The rights are borrowed on conditional terms.

So to answer your question of why they'd ever expect to get the rights back: Because licensing is conditional and temporary. It made sense at the time they granted the licensing. However, now that Marvel has their own film production company and doesn't depend on other film studios to make their movies, they're pursing the film rights. And THIS is precisely what business is.
Nightwing1015
Nightwing1015 - 1/4/2021, 2:20 PM
@Tonic24k - Oh year Venom sucks. I was talking only about financial success.

"Marvel can absolutely be as demanding as they want to be"

Well apparently not seeing as they caved when they realised Sony was willing to walk. Their demandingness got them nowhere. I believe this was mainly because of Sony's recent film successes. If it hadn't been for them, yes I agree Marvel could have had more of their demands met.

Yeah fair enough on the film licensing. It's not as damning as having sold the rights. But I guess my point is that Sony is under no obligation to give up that agreement. As long as they stick to the licensing deal, they could keep making those films forever. Sony should only change that agreement if it is in their interests to do so. And in the end, they knew it wouldn't be in their interests to accept the initial deal and decided to wait for a better one to come along (which it did only weeks later)
Tonic24k
Tonic24k - 1/4/2021, 7:55 PM
@Nightwing1015 - Didn't they just stalemate? I recall Disney letting Sony walk away. Then it seemed they came back to the table a couple months later and renegotiated something else in "the interest of the fans". I mean...we'll never know what was really said in those meetings. But I do think Sony isn't completely confident in themselves without some association with Marvel Studios. It's why they're negotiating in the first place. Otherwise, they wouldn't be entertaining any new deals. Which concerns the hell out of me because I absolutely don't want Sony's spider-verse--or venom-verse--becoming canon with the MCU.

At the end of they day, I just want all Marvel characters under one roof. Disney acquired a ton of properties they could use as bargaining chips. But of course the problem is: what's as appealing as Spider-Man? I'm not sure Sony would take 20 properties in exchange for this one.

At any rate, here's to hoping what lies ahead isn't a cluster fvck.
Nightwing1015
Nightwing1015 - 1/5/2021, 7:20 AM
@Tonic24k - Yes exactly, I think Sony are pushing for Venom to become MCU canon so let's hope they don't start negetivley influencing the MCU
Tonic24k
Tonic24k - 1/5/2021, 7:24 AM
@Nightwing1015 - I'm 100% with you there.
Blergh
Blergh - 1/3/2021, 6:23 AM
Totally happy for Tom. He seems grateful for his career and acts like it.
Can't say that for many younger actors that soon after their rise in fame become more than abnoxious.

Hope for many more great Tom Holland movies to come our way. I'd love to see Tom Holland work under Tom Holland in a Fright Night Sequel for the name-sake jokes.
rexlincoln
rexlincoln - 1/3/2021, 8:22 AM
@Blergh - And have Tom Hollander play the Vampire.
TheShellyMan
TheShellyMan - 1/3/2021, 7:29 AM
Speaking of Spider-Man, we should be getting a new trailer of Morbius soon, since that movie is coming out on 3/19/21.
bobevanz
bobevanz - 1/3/2021, 8:54 AM
@ShellyMando - they should release it on crackle lmao
rexlincoln
rexlincoln - 1/3/2021, 8:26 AM
I don't think a lot of people realise he was acting before and during playing Peter. With some pretty big names as well.

He was in the Impossible as Ewan McGregor and Naomi Watts' son
Voice Tom Hardy's son in Locke
He was great in In the Heart of the Sea
Great small role in The Lost City of Z
I really liked how he acted off Benedict Cumberbatch in The Current War
And he was great in The Devil All the Time.

Dude's a good actor, looking forward to Cherry. And Spider-Man ofcourse.
ModHaterSLADE
ModHaterSLADE - 1/3/2021, 9:03 AM
He's pretty good in the role. Good for him.
JFerguson
JFerguson - 1/3/2021, 10:47 AM
Sony, give me the trailer now!! Or give me a Venom:LTBC trailer! I've waited long enough!!
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